Display Base and Pedestals

Nomad

Nomad

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As I near the completion of my first ship model my thoughts turn to how I might mount it for display. So far I have purchased a pearwood base and two brass pedestals. I understand that I need to determine the position of the two holes in the base for the pedestals, and to countersink the screws so that they lie flush at the bottom of the base.

What I am unsure of is whether the screws extend through the base and pedestal into the keel of the ship itself? I doubt that the ship would be stable on the pedestals otherwise, but it seems a bit daunting to drill holes in the keel of your completed ship at this stage of the game :oops:

An example:

1649116057769.png

The kit did not come with any instructions, but given that the 'screws' are actually bolts and are also not long enough to extend all the way into the keel, I can only assume that they are only meant to fasten the pedestals to the wood base and that the ship, consequently, is housed loosely in the two pedestal slots. This does not strike me a very secure.

I'm sure there are many different ways to skin this cat, but any advice would be most appreciated :)
- Mark
 
Hi Mark,
that type of pedestal arrangement needs forward planning. I add bolts and nuts inside the hull at building stage with 2 part epoxy.

The bolts slide inside the brass pedestals. I guess you could drill pilot holes in the keel and use long self tapping screws that fit inside the pedestal hole.
 
Bryian said:
Hi Mark,
that type of pedestal arrangement needs forward planning. I add bolts and nuts inside the hull at building stage with 2 part epoxy.

The bolts slide inside the brass pedestals. I guess you could drill pilot holes in the keel and use long self tapping screws that fit inside the pedestal hole.
Click to expand...
Thanks Bryian, that makes sense. Although inserting nuts inside my hull was probably the furthest thing from my mind when I started this build ROTF

Failing that however, I think you are right in suggesting long self-tapping screws to connect the entire assembly together Thumbsup
 
Hi Mark,

I will be facing the same dilemma. It never occurred to me to provide for a base. My solution will be to create twin cradles. It won't look as nice as posts, but I can't possibly drill into my keel at this point.

Anyway, I thought I'd share this just in case it might provide fuel for a solution for your ship...
 
dockattner said:
Hi Mark,

I will be facing the same dilemma. It never occurred to me to provide for a base. My solution will be to create twin cradles. It won't look as nice as posts, but I can't possibly drill into my keel at this point.

Anyway, I thought I'd share this just in case it might provide fuel for a solution for your ship...
Click to expand...
Hi Paul, thanks for your input. Yes I can see the sense in cradles as well, especially if you haven't catered for the nuts-and-bolts fixtures at the start of your build like Bryian did. The thought of drilling into my keel at this stage gives me the shivers, but with these brass fittings I don't think I have too many options.

A cradle might also allow for a certain degree of adjustment if the mounted ship is not exactly upright. I have heard of cases where the ship has a slight list after being fixed to metal fittings, although I wonder if that had more to do with an original alignment fault in the keel itself.

Anyway, food for thought. I must admit that the base-and-pedestal approach does give the overall presentation a certain grace and elegance, such as this:

1649126041433.png

Ahhh, decisions, decisions. I'm sure it will all become clearer to me in time :p

- Mark
 
paulv1958 said:
You could make a clear perspex ( Acrylic) stand as an option.
Click to expand...
That also makes sense. A bit like a cradle I suppose. I'd need two things for that though ... 1) Perspex, and 2) Knowledge and tools to cut the perspex :p

Thanks for the idea though, I'll bear that in mind Thumbsup
 
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DARIVS ARCHITECTVS said:
I went with a hybrid between pedestals and twin saddles. La Couronne has twin pedestals and a single saddle in the center for stability.

View attachment 300807
Click to expand...
Aha, so there's the third option, a combination of pedestals and cradles. The cradle in this instance would presumably take some pressure off the two pedestal fittings while adding greater stability to the assembly as a whole. I like it, although I'll need to learn how to craft a wooden cradle that correctly follows the contours of my ship's hull Redface
 
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Nomad said:
Aha, so there's the third option, a combination of pedestals and cradles. The cradle in this instance would presumably take some pressure off the two pedestal fittings while adding greater stability to the assembly as a whole. I like it, although I'll need to learn how to craft a wooden cradle that correctly follows the contours of my ship's hull Redface
Click to expand...
The cradle prevents the pedestals from breaking off your keel if the hull takes a bump. You can use a contour gage to quickly transfer the shape of your hull to a piece of wood. That's how i did it. It is made of lots of thin fingers of metal or plastic and you press the tool against the hull and it shapes itself to it. The ones below sell cheap at Amazon for $19.00. Link

1649142467063.png
 
DARIVS ARCHITECTVS said:
The cradle prevents the pedestals from breaking off your keel if the hull takes a bump. You can use a contour gage to quickly transfer the shape of your hull to a piece of wood. That's how i did it. It is made of lots of thin fingers of metal or plastic and you press the tool against the hull and it shapes itself to it. The ones below sell cheap at Amazon for $19.00. Link

View attachment 300815
Click to expand...
This is a very useful tool and should be in every workshop - important is that it has as much as possible of these fingers, so you get the best result.
Mine is made out of metal like this one
62840.jpg

Fehler • Modellskipper.de

Fehler - Oft gestelle Fragen zu Inhalten von Modellskipper.de
www.modellskipper.de www.modellskipper.de

DV_8_3664673_01_4c_DE_20200110080158.jpg
 
DARIVS ARCHITECTVS said:
The cradle prevents the pedestals from breaking off your keel if the hull takes a bump. You can use a contour gage to quickly transfer the shape of your hull to a piece of wood. That's how i did it. It is made of lots of thin fingers of metal or plastic and you press the tool against the hull and it shapes itself to it. The ones below sell cheap at Amazon for $19.00. Link

View attachment 300815
Click to expand...
Brilliant, thanks for sharing Thumbsup
 
dockattner said:
Hi Mark,

I will be facing the same dilemma. It never occurred to me to provide for a base. My solution will be to create twin cradles. It won't look as nice as posts, but I can't possibly drill into my keel at this point.

Anyway, I thought I'd share this just in case it might provide fuel for a solution for your ship...
Click to expand...
You do see some very handsome cradles, though. Look around and you might see a design you like.
 
Mounting the model should be dealt with early on in the build as Nomad points out. For plank on bulkhead models I drill holes in the keel piece for mounting attachments before the bulkheads are installed so it can be clamped in a vise. Depending on the thickness of the keel the holes are sized for either 4d or 6d nails which will later be epoxied into the keel. I used to use pedestals but have switched to cradles for greater security. I make these from 1/4" Home Depot poplar sheets. They are fitted to the hull after the planking is complete while it can still be turned upside down . When finished, the cradles are also drilled in the center and attached to the model by expoxing in the the exposed portion of the nail. Most of this process is pictued in my bulid log for Berbice:

Berbice, a 1780 Schooner in 1/85 Scale [COMPLETED BUILD]

One of the disadvantages of making ship models for about 40 years is running out of space to house them. To keep on with the hobby I have started to build smaller vessels and give them to friends and family. In looking to start a new modeling project, I went to my favorite source for plans...
shipsofscale.com
 
For my model of the Vasa, I intend using three brass pedestals. I have had a commercial Perspex case made but in my original measurements I didn’t allow quite enough mast height, so I have made the pedestals quite short to allow a suitable fit.

I will be screwing through the pedestals upwards into the keel, and then the pedestals can be bolted downwards into the wooden base. I will then have to judge how strongly the three pedestals secure the ship. If there is any movement, a cradle may be necessary. I especially like the idea of a mirror beneath and the use of the Guage to accurately shape it.

Regards,
PeterG
 
PeterG said:
For my model of the Vasa, I intend using three brass pedestals. I have had a commercial Perspex case made but in my original measurements I didn’t allow quite enough mast height, so I have made the pedestals quite short to allow a suitable fit.

I will be screwing through the pedestals upwards into the keel, and then the pedestals can be bolted downwards into the wooden base. I will then have to judge how strongly the three pedestals secure the ship. If there is any movement, a cradle may be necessary. I especially like the idea of a mirror beneath and the use of the Guage to accurately shape it.

Regards,
PeterG
Click to expand...
Pedestals are quite sturdy if the internal metal, the threaded rod, has internal threaded anchors firmly fastened within the keel and bulkheads in the hull. If the model case will not be transported, heavily bumped, or jostled, the pedestals are perfectly fine. If you need to move your model, much more support in the form of cradles and even guy lines from the mast to the display base, much like additional shrouds, are necessary to ensure the model gets where it is going intact. I understand that packing a model for transport to a model show or museum is carefully thought out such that support lines will not break masts, and straps over the hull will not demolish railings and bulwarks. I do not prefer to permanently fasten the model to the supports and thus use one or two cradles. I can release the electrical lighting wiring and lift the model in both my hands like King Kong, minus the earth splitting *SMASH* that would usually follow in the storyline, especially if Fay Wray is accurately modeled on the ship.
 
DARIVS ARCHITECTVS said:
Pedestals are quite sturdy if the internal metal, the threaded rod, has internal threaded anchors firmly fastened within the keel and bulkheads in the hull. If the model case will not be transported, heavily bumped, or jostled, the pedestals are perfectly fine. If you need to move your model, much more support in the form of cradles and even guy lines from the mast to the display base, much like additional shrouds, are necessary to ensure the model gets where it is going intact. I understand that packing a model for transport to a model show or museum is carefully thought out such that support lines will not break masts, and straps over the hull will not demolish railings and bulwarks. I do not prefer to permanently fasten the model to the supports and thus use one or two cradles. I can release the electrical lighting wiring and lift the model in both my hands like King Kong, minus the earth splitting *SMASH* that would usually follow in the storyline, especially if Fay Wray is accurately modeled on the ship.
Click to expand...
I prefer cradles too. I use the flimsy one supplied by the kit as a pattern for a much more sturdy home made version.
 
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Thanks Kurt. I think the pedestals should be OK and there are three of them. I am going to take this approach and see how it works out.

As for moving the model, the only time it comes out of its perspex box after being placed there is when I am being slotted into a box of a different shape, so this should not be an issue.

Regards,
PeterG
 
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