mayflower

shipahoy

shipahoy

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Jan 31, 2019
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vancouver island british columbia canada
wondering if anyone might have a detailed spec of the running rigging of the Mayflower. i am scratch building and am looking for the correct rigging in particular of the forcastle and bowsprit rigging (with sail). looking for location and number of belay pins in the forcastle area. plans i have are from amati and are somewhat lacking. i know M.S. in the U.S.A. has good plans, but the shipping costs are more than i can justify.
 
thanks cumbrianlad, yeah i did find that helpfull for a lot of the little extas that i wanted to add to the rigging, like tackles, rams head blocks for the halyards ect. I was hoping to find a belay pin overhead plan that showed where each fall tied off, but no such luck.
 
Believe me when I say this could be the blind leading the blind, but if you can't find more detailed running rigging of Mayflower, another ship of that period could serve you well. The more I delve into my 'San Francisco II' model and want to improve it, the more I find that accurate and authenticated information is simply not present. I'm currently toying with the guns carried by my ship... so far, I've found very little, except that the guns provided with the kit can't be right.

In your case, it may not end up being absolutely accurate, but ships rigged with the same sail layout would surely have similar rigging, especially from the same period, but a mizzen mast will always have had to be manipulated in the same way... so it would need similar rigging, at the very least. As an engineer, I know that compromise is sometimes needed.

I guess I'm saying to broaden your search beyond 'Mayflower'. I'm also saying that whilst it's admirable to find the 'exact' rigging... it may not be possible. More detailed rigging for other ships is a good start. There comes a time when you have to go with the best you have available. I for one, won't be coming to your house, looking at your 'Mayflower' and saying: "Nice... but that double block on the mainsail? Terrible. You ought to be ashamed!"

I'd welcome more knowledgeable people diving in here and telling me why I'm wrong! I'd especially love someone giving you a lovely rigging diagram. I'm a mechanical design engineer. I adopt horse-sense and practical answers where I have no others available. That doesn't stop me seeking accurate answers in the first place. I wish you well. I admire your desire to get this 'right'.
 
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shipahoy said:
thanks cumbrianlad, yeah i did find that helpfull for a lot of the little extas that i wanted to add to the rigging, like tackles, rams head blocks for the halyards ect. I was hoping to find a belay pin overhead plan that showed where each fall tied off, but no such luck.
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Here are some belay points from the Noel CL Hackney book "Mayflower: Classic Ships Their History & How to Model Them", published in 1970 by Patrick Stephens Ltd.Mayflower Rigging Points.jpg
 
Exact rigging plans of any ship model does not need to be the goal. Instead look for a consensus of rigging plans for ships of similar rig and period. Why? Every ship’s Captain had their own ideas on how to best rig their ship for the best performance. A stay anchored here rather than there…a running line belayed there instead of here. Therefore small differences in belay points can still be historically “accurate.” One need not be always “exact!”
 
danielsje said:
Exact rigging plans of any ship model does not need to be the goal. Instead look for a consensus of rigging plans for ships of similar rig and period. Why? Every ship’s Captain had their own ideas on how to best rig their ship for the best performance. A stay anchored here rather than there…a running line belayed there instead of here. Therefore small differences in belay points can still be historically “accurate.” One need not be always “exact!”
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That's an interesting comment and one that I'll bear in mind. It's similar to my 'horse-sense' take on the matter, but more informed. Appreciated.
 
thanks for the input and ideas. i have been studying the various photos and videos of the mayflower 2 and have come up with the anwwers to most of my questions regarding rigging with sails. this build is a commissioned model so i am trying to be as accurate as possible. i did check columbus's ships and there are some similarities which i adopted. thank's kurt.
i will post some pics of here when i finish the front end. ( i work front to back )
 
This might help a little....The Hackney book is a very good book, but it is directly related to the building of the Airfix Mayflower kit, so the directions, which do not include all of the rigging, are geared for that kit. Another suggestion that I have is "The Mayflower and other colonial vessels" by William A Baker. He was the designer of the Mayflower II and this book has considerable detail. Appendix B in this little book begins with 'Rigging,' and in short sentences or paragraphs tells you the length, diameter, lay, location, etc of every line. I should think this would be more like what you are seeking. Even if isn't perfect, it's is a great book for learning about the Mayflower. Publisher is Conway Maritime Press (UK) and the ISBN is 0 85177. Tre should be a decent copy out there on Amazon or Abe Books.
 
thanks peegee. i checked it out but at 70$ canadian plus not great reviews i will take a pass. i am using anderson book "the rigging of ships in the days of the spritsail topmast n1600-1720" as a guide and for the most part it jives with other publications and plans. like danielsje posted earlier one does not need to be exact as the captain rigged a ship as they saw fit to maximize efficiency. 20220228_174226.jpg20220228_174134.jpg20220228_174250.jpg20220228_174338.jpg20220228_174226.jpg20220228_174134.jpg
 
Pictures look really great! I had no idea that the Baker book would be that expensive. I do not blame you one bit for not getting it, besides R. C. Anderson is a wonderful resource as well.
 
shipahoy said:
wondering if anyone might have a detailed spec of the running rigging of the Mayflower. i am scratch building and am looking for the correct rigging in particular of the forcastle and bowsprit rigging (with sail). looking for location and number of belay pins in the forcastle area. plans i have are from amati and are somewhat lacking. i know M.S. in the U.S.A. has good plans, but the shipping costs are more than i can justify.
Click to expand...
Hallo @shipahoy
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