Hi, new member from England

[Mike Y]

Hi everyone, I've just joined the group and am looking forward to learning lots about this great hobby; judging from the look of some of the pictures and posts it looks like I've come to the right spot!
Although I've built scale models since I was a kid (and am now a grandfather and retired) it's previously been plastic kits mostly of F1 racing cars and military vehicles; now, however I've 'inherited' a wooden plank-on-frame model of HMS (or HMAV) Bounty which is in dire need of repair. This ship is about 27" (69 cm) overall length and 24" (61cm) in height from keel to mainmast head, and I guess it's about 1/50 or thereabouts in scale. It was given to me by a friend who, in turn, had it given to him; since my friend is half way through building a model of the Sovereign Of The Seas (in weekly/monthly part-work form) he had no time for this additional model and thus passed it on to me. At this stage I'm not sure whether I should be glad about this because it seems to need a large amount of work, chiefly on the running rigging, to get it back to anything like a decent standard and I've not been able so far to find a good rigging plan for this vessel. I used to have an interest in sailing ships mainly of the clipper era and at one time knew lots of the names and functions of rigging components but some of those memory cells have now given up the ghost! Also I've been lucky enough to have been around the Cutty Sark in Greenwich and the Victory in Portsmouth in the past.
I do have several books on rigging including ones by Lennarth Petersson, Harold Underhill and R.C.Anderson so I can see the sort of generic rigging of the time but would obviously prefer to get the 'real thing' of a plan of this particular ship so if anyone has any suggestions I'd be very grateful.
At this point I'm still at the early stages of cleaning the years of grime off the model and trying to untangle the mess of rigging but much of it now seems very fragile and breaks easily. I've taken some photos of the 'before' state of the model and put them on Flickr - the link is here :-

https://www.flickr.com/photos/96640387@N07/sets/72157646435592999/

in case anyone wants to look. I've no idea who made the model kit but there seem to be lots of inaccuracies relating to the deck-plan, the figurehead and the colour scheme to name only a few. Perhaps I've bitten off a bit more than I can chew but I'd welcome any advice of input from the members.
I live in south west England but visit New York at least once a year to stay with my daughter and family; other hobbies include photography, amusing myself playing guitar very badly and travelling. I look forward to following the group's activities and admiring the work of everyone. Thanks again for reading this and best wishes to all.
Mike

 

[Donnie]

Hi Mike !
I am very happy to have you on board. Right off, I think your Bounty is a nice one to work with. It seems the previous builder did have a respectable model going on there.

Looks like a lot of the "running rigging" is suffering from either come loose or has lost its tightness in the lines.

I have to confess that I am not sure who manufactured this model, but it does seem worth to put a little time into it.

When it comes to rigging, I have found that a lot of just follows a pattern and most of it is just repeating rigging from one yard to another. If I had this model to work with, i am not sure if I would cut off all the running rigging and just start over or to try to relocate where things are supposed to go.

Just to give you some idea and this is off the top of my head. And of course we have to throw in the Period the ship style and who knows what. I have to confess also, that I am not a rigging expert and especially the rigging of different eras, countries, regions etc. You would have to be a professor of nautical on this one.
But, here it goes:
1) usually, you have "Bitts" and "Rails" that hug the base of each mast. You might have one Bitt or two Bitts or a Rail that sweeps around the base of the mast. Usually, your YARD LIFTS are tied off on these. So, usually, your main course yard (very bottom yard) would use two lifts positioned on each side of the yard tying off at the Bitts. Then the next few or several yards up to like the royal yard, ect, might only have one line lift to tie off a the Bitts. (hince there is your pattern for that).
Other tie off points near the base of the mast would be used to secure your "Stays" and "Preventer Stays" lines that run between the mast (fore and aft).
2) Your belaying pins on the pin rails that are racks along the port and starboard of the hull are tie off points to manage your sails and yard management. Leech Lines, Bunt Lines, Sheets.
3) Yard (Tacking-Braces) lines usually tie off at your "Stays" lines or pass through blocks on the "Stays" and then pass on and tie off at Belaying points.
4) each Mast should have about 2 or 3 sets of belaying pins associated with that mast of yards directly located port and starboard. You would never use like the foremast yards lines to tie off at a belaying point to the main or mizzen. All lines are usually grouped in the main general area of the mast - yards that are associated. If you go to my Trinidad Build, you will see most of this done this way.

Donnie

 

[GaryM]

Based upon what I see, this is a kit model that was assembled using the kit given lines and instructions. The person did not know anything about rigging or the difference between standing and running rigging. Thus, the color of line used is incorrect for a lot rigging. Also, the size of line used is incorrect. To correct all this would mean a complete re-rigging and replacement of almost all the blocks and dead-eye with appropriate sizes. All of this would require a lot of expense, research, etc. Historic Ship Models by Mondfeld would be needed to do this somewhat correctly. I used 19 different sizes of line and numerous sizes of blocks etc. on my last model.
If you are going to continue in this hobby after completing the rigging of this model, then what you get to do this could be used on future ship. If not, then just tightening up the existing rigging is the way to go. Otherwise, you have to decide what level of detail you want to put in to fix another person's model.

 

[Donnie]

Gary,
that is correct and for the most part, an experienced person like you would recognize all these discrepancies. I think it just depends on the person as to how much time effort and authenticity they are willing to invest.

Donnie

 

[GaryM]

The point I was trying to make is that you can choose between using what comes with the build (this applies to kits also) or upgrade portions of the rigging, changing some of the blocks or any combination from zero upgrade to a complete rework and upgrade. What is usually the limiting factor is the cost to buy the after market items and the time required to do the extra detailing. Other hidden factors are time delay to get the items, over or under buying the amount of rope, blocks, etc. and purchasing the right reference books.
Since I have been modeling for years, I have built up supplies to the point now where I have most of everything I need to do the above and only have to replace what is used.

 

[Donnie]

Yep,
thats the advantage of being way ahead of the game. My next build is going to be like starting over again with materials. I do have some scrap stuff left over from OcCre though, but I am not sure if I want to see any more OcCre laying around or not !!!

 

[Mike Y]

Hi Donnie & GaryM
Many thanks for your helpful and prompt replies to my questions. To a large extent you've more or less confirmed my own feelings that a complete re-rigging would be necessary to bring the model to any state of accuracy and a lot of work would therefore be required. I also feel that, even were this to be done, the vessel would still not be a true representation of the Bounty in view of the deck layout mistakes and other aspects that would be obvious to any viewer with knowledge of the ship's real appearance and features.
What I'll probably do is to replace the broken lines and belay them in their proper places using whatever reference material I can find, clean and tidy the masts and spars and leave it at that for now; in some ways it seems trickier to repair someone else's work than to build something in the correct sequence from the very beginning.
I am keen to do this with a model build and am sure that the build logs and contributions from members will prove invaluable in this process. At present I'm looking at potential kits for a suitable vessel and am quite interested in the part-work offerings of firms like D'Agostino one of whose ships a friend of mine is currently building and whose quality seems very good.
I've been doing some searching on the internet and came across many sites of varying usefulness; one of the best I found was at http://shipmodeling.ca/aa300.html#05 which has a page of links to many valuable resources including downloadable books in 'pdf' format and addresses for suppliers etc.
Thanks for your help, I'll be sure to keep an eye on the forums and the web-site and wish you success in your present and future projects.
All the best for now,
Mike

 

[GaryM]

D'Agostino seems to be a favorite but what I have noticed is that they are very inaccurate but designed to look good to a buyer that has not seen what the real model should look like. Also, if you read the forums, people that have bought from them are unhappy with service, incorrect shipments, etc. They are getting rich off of people that are new to the hobby or those that do not have the discipline to save money and buy a better, more correct version of the desired ship.
Of course, this is what I have determined but it is just my opinion and observations. There may be others that are OK with them and just have not posted on any of the modeling sites.

 

[Uwek]

Hi everyone, I've just joined the group and am looking forward to learning lots about this great hobby; judging from the look of some of the pictures and posts it looks like I've come to the right spot!
Although I've built scale models since I was a kid (and am now a grandfather and retired) it's previously been plastic kits mostly of F1 racing cars and military vehicles; now, however I've 'inherited' a wooden plank-on-frame model of HMS (or HMAV) Bounty which is in dire need of repair. This ship is about 27" (69 cm) overall length and 24" (61cm) in height from keel to mainmast head, and I guess it's about 1/50 or thereabouts in scale. It was given to me by a friend who, in turn, had it given to him; since my friend is half way through building a model of the Sovereign Of The Seas (in weekly/monthly part-work form) he had no time for this additional model and thus passed it on to me. At this stage I'm not sure whether I should be glad about this because it seems to need a large amount of work, chiefly on the running rigging, to get it back to anything like a decent standard and I've not been able so far to find a good rigging plan for this vessel. I used to have an interest in sailing ships mainly of the clipper era and at one time knew lots of the names and functions of rigging components but some of those memory cells have now given up the ghost! Also I've been lucky enough to have been around the Cutty Sark in Greenwich and the Victory in Portsmouth in the past.
I do have several books on rigging including ones by Lennarth Petersson, Harold Underhill and R.C.Anderson so I can see the sort of generic rigging of the time but would obviously prefer to get the 'real thing' of a plan of this particular ship so if anyone has any suggestions I'd be very grateful.
At this point I'm still at the early stages of cleaning the years of grime off the model and trying to untangle the mess of rigging but much of it now seems very fragile and breaks easily. I've taken some photos of the 'before' state of the model and put them on Flickr - the link is here :-

HMS Bounty model

Scale model of HMS Bounty (1794) in a state of some disrepair 'inherited' from a friend. Hopefully to be repaired - mainly the running rigging needing attention. Photos as of 23rd August 2014 at start of project.

www.flickr.com

in case anyone wants to look. I've no idea who made the model kit but there seem to be lots of inaccuracies relating to the deck-plan, the figurehead and the colour scheme to name only a few. Perhaps I've bitten off a bit more than I can chew but I'd welcome any advice of input from the members.
I live in south west England but visit New York at least once a year to stay with my daughter and family; other hobbies include photography, amusing myself playing guitar very badly and travelling. I look forward to following the group's activities and admiring the work of everyone. Thanks again for reading this and best wishes to all.
Mike

Hallo Mike alias @Mike Y
we wish you all the BEST and a HAPPY BIRTHDAY

 

[Uwek]

Hi everyone, I've just joined the group and am looking forward to learning lots about this great hobby; judging from the look of some of the pictures and posts it looks like I've come to the right spot!
Although I've built scale models since I was a kid (and am now a grandfather and retired) it's previously been plastic kits mostly of F1 racing cars and military vehicles; now, however I've 'inherited' a wooden plank-on-frame model of HMS (or HMAV) Bounty which is in dire need of repair. This ship is about 27" (69 cm) overall length and 24" (61cm) in height from keel to mainmast head, and I guess it's about 1/50 or thereabouts in scale. It was given to me by a friend who, in turn, had it given to him; since my friend is half way through building a model of the Sovereign Of The Seas (in weekly/monthly part-work form) he had no time for this additional model and thus passed it on to me. At this stage I'm not sure whether I should be glad about this because it seems to need a large amount of work, chiefly on the running rigging, to get it back to anything like a decent standard and I've not been able so far to find a good rigging plan for this vessel. I used to have an interest in sailing ships mainly of the clipper era and at one time knew lots of the names and functions of rigging components but some of those memory cells have now given up the ghost! Also I've been lucky enough to have been around the Cutty Sark in Greenwich and the Victory in Portsmouth in the past.
I do have several books on rigging including ones by Lennarth Petersson, Harold Underhill and R.C.Anderson so I can see the sort of generic rigging of the time but would obviously prefer to get the 'real thing' of a plan of this particular ship so if anyone has any suggestions I'd be very grateful.
At this point I'm still at the early stages of cleaning the years of grime off the model and trying to untangle the mess of rigging but much of it now seems very fragile and breaks easily. I've taken some photos of the 'before' state of the model and put them on Flickr - the link is here :-

HMS Bounty model

Scale model of HMS Bounty (1794) in a state of some disrepair 'inherited' from a friend. Hopefully to be repaired - mainly the running rigging needing attention. Photos as of 23rd August 2014 at start of project.

www.flickr.com

in case anyone wants to look. I've no idea who made the model kit but there seem to be lots of inaccuracies relating to the deck-plan, the figurehead and the colour scheme to name only a few. Perhaps I've bitten off a bit more than I can chew but I'd welcome any advice of input from the members.
I live in south west England but visit New York at least once a year to stay with my daughter and family; other hobbies include photography, amusing myself playing guitar very badly and travelling. I look forward to following the group's activities and admiring the work of everyone. Thanks again for reading this and best wishes to all.
Mike

One of our longest members has birthday today
Hallo Mike alias @Mike Y
we wish you all the BEST and a HAPPY BIRTHDAY

 

[Masters Mate]

Hi everyone, I've just joined the group and am looking forward to learning lots about this great hobby; judging from the look of some of the pictures and posts it looks like I've come to the right spot!
Although I've built scale models since I was a kid (and am now a grandfather and retired) it's previously been plastic kits mostly of F1 racing cars and military vehicles; now, however I've 'inherited' a wooden plank-on-frame model of HMS (or HMAV) Bounty which is in dire need of repair. This ship is about 27" (69 cm) overall length and 24" (61cm) in height from keel to mainmast head, and I guess it's about 1/50 or thereabouts in scale. It was given to me by a friend who, in turn, had it given to him; since my friend is half way through building a model of the Sovereign Of The Seas (in weekly/monthly part-work form) he had no time for this additional model and thus passed it on to me. At this stage I'm not sure whether I should be glad about this because it seems to need a large amount of work, chiefly on the running rigging, to get it back to anything like a decent standard and I've not been able so far to find a good rigging plan for this vessel. I used to have an interest in sailing ships mainly of the clipper era and at one time knew lots of the names and functions of rigging components but some of those memory cells have now given up the ghost! Also I've been lucky enough to have been around the Cutty Sark in Greenwich and the Victory in Portsmouth in the past.
I do have several books on rigging including ones by Lennarth Petersson, Harold Underhill and R.C.Anderson so I can see the sort of generic rigging of the time but would obviously prefer to get the 'real thing' of a plan of this particular ship so if anyone has any suggestions I'd be very grateful.
At this point I'm still at the early stages of cleaning the years of grime off the model and trying to untangle the mess of rigging but much of it now seems very fragile and breaks easily. I've taken some photos of the 'before' state of the model and put them on Flickr - the link is here :-

HMS Bounty model

Scale model of HMS Bounty (1794) in a state of some disrepair 'inherited' from a friend. Hopefully to be repaired - mainly the running rigging needing attention. Photos as of 23rd August 2014 at start of project.

www.flickr.com

in case anyone wants to look. I've no idea who made the model kit but there seem to be lots of inaccuracies relating to the deck-plan, the figurehead and the colour scheme to name only a few. Perhaps I've bitten off a bit more than I can chew but I'd welcome any advice of input from the members.
I live in south west England but visit New York at least once a year to stay with my daughter and family; other hobbies include photography, amusing myself playing guitar very badly and travelling. I look forward to following the group's activities and admiring the work of everyone. Thanks again for reading this and best wishes to all.
Mike

Welcome Mike
She's a beauty and well worth restoring.

In case you haven't come across it yet, our experienced member Olha has a really good restoration video which might help you choose what to replace and what to keep.

Restoration & Upgrading of the HMS BOREAS (1774) - scale 1:48

Restoration & Upgrading of the frigate HMS BOREAS (1774) scale 1:48 (1,4 m / 55 inch long)

shipsofscale.com

Good luck and looking forward to your progress reports.