Researching the Dutch ship Fortuyn (Fortune) 1614


Well-Known Member
Staff member
Dec 25, 2017

Vienna, Austria
there was a wreck studied of a ship built in North America by Rene Robert Cavalier La Salle. Here is a wood cut of the ship under construction, looking at the round stern it looks like a Fluit this was built around 1670ish and the Dutch were well established in North America at this time. There is a thesis on this wreck and several plans drawn.
One thing I noticed is the palm tree odd because the ship was built in upper New York the wreck studied was in Lake Huron, Canada best to my knowledge palm trees do not grow in Canada.

HOWEVER the wood cut was published in nouvelle Decouverte d'um tres grand pays situe' dans l'amerique 1697 so that is like almost 30 years after the building so father Hennepin who traveled with La Salle, maybe the good Father confused details from the travels "understandable"

View attachment 48280
This is the Griffon, or?

The picture you are showing is made 1697 and called "Construction du Griffon en 1678-1679 sur le bord de la riviere Niagara en Ontario, gravure de Louis Hennepin tire du livre "Nouvelle Decouverte" de 1697.


At you can find this explanation (together with a lot of references):

Le Griffon's pattern closely followed the prevailing type used by explorers to cross the Atlantic Ocean to the New World. The exact size and construction of Le Griffon is not known. The widely referenced antique woodcutting of Le Griffon shows her with 2 masts but many researchers believe she was a 45-ton barque with a single mast with several square sails and 30 to 40 feet (9.1 to 12.2 m) long with a 10-to-15-foot (3.0 to 4.6 m) beam.

Hennepin's first account says she was a vessel of about 45 tons; his second says 60 tons. Because his second account has numerous exaggerations and cases where he credits himself for things that La Salle had done, Hennepin's first account is considered more reliable. In any case, Le Griffon was larger than any other vessel on the lakes at the time, and as far as contemporary reports can confirm, the first named vessel.

Father Louis Hennepin's "Nouvelle Decouverte" (Utrecht, 1697)


Well-Known Member
Jun 30, 2017

This is the Griffon, or?

the wreck that was studied was more of the "or" what it was never actually identified as the Griffon


New Member
Feb 5, 2018

Buena Park, California
Can you re-post the article a bit smaller some of the info is cut off, some time on the left some time on the right.

it is not the size of the file posted it is because the original book is bigger than the scanner I could rescan the pages in 2 sections.

rather than rescan the pages in pieces and stitch them back together if you have any question about the text just ask and i can look at the original and tell you want is missing
I can figure out most of the info, so if I have a question I'll sent you a note, Thanks Fred
Jul 26, 2013

My translator app going to get a work out. [/QUOTE said:
For what it's worth. I've found DeepL-
Does a better job than google translate. Interface is a little clankier, with no resident "translate web page" feature, but the results are worth it. A lot of great information is bubbling up in this thread!