44 Gun 2 Deck Frigate Roebuck (1774) 1:48th Scale

JosephH

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#1
Hey guys we been going through the thousands of wtuff from Harold Hahn and came across a ship that just slammed me as THE ship for me. Finally after months of looking for a project that really tripped my trigger it popped up today so I thought I would start a little log on it.

Project Overview

This will be drawn with Solidworks at full scale and built at 1:48th scale. I will be designing and building at the same time. So as i finish say the Keel Assy I will then build it.

Specs on the ship are as follows:

General characteristics Class and type:fifth-rate

Tons burthen: 879 26⁄94
  • 140 feet 0 inches (42.7 m) (gundeck)
  • 115 feet 9 inches (35.3 m) (keel)
Beam: 37 feet 9 1⁄2 inches (11.5 m)

Depth of hold: 16 feet 4 inches (5.0 m)Propulsion:Sails

Sail plan: Fully-rigged ship

Complement: 280–300

Armament:
So for the Model that comes to:

  • 35 inches (gundeck)
  • 29.9375 inches (gundeck)
  • 9.448 inches (beam)
 

JosephH

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#2
History:

HMS Roebuck was a 44-gun, fifth-rate ship of the Royal Navy which served in the American and French Revolutionary Wars. Designed by Sir Thomas Slade in 1769, to operate in the shallower waters of North America, she joined Lord Howe's squadron towards the end of 1775 and took part in operations against New York the following year, engaging the American gun batteries at Red Hook during the Battle of Long Island in August 1776, and forcing a passage up the Hudson River in October. On 25 August 1777, Roebuck escorted troopships to Turkey Point, Maryland, where an army was landed for an assault on Philadelphia. She was again called upon to accompany troopships in December 1779; this time for an attack on Charleston. When the ships-of-the-line, which were too large to enter the harbour, were sent back to New York, Admiral Marriot Arbuthnot made Roebuck his flagship. She was therefore at the front of the attack; leading the British squadron across the bar to engage Fort Moultrie and the American ships beyond.

Construction and Fitting:

In October 1783, Roebuck underwent repairs at Sheerness and was refitted as hospital ship. She served in this capacity during the capture of Martinique, Guadeloupe and St Lucia by a British fleet under Vice-Admiral Sir John Jervis in 1794. Recommissioned as a troopship in July 1799, Roebuck was part of the fleet, under the command of Vice-Admiral Sir Andrew Mitchell, to which the Dutch surrendered in the Vlieter Incident, on 30 August. Following the Treaty of Amiens in March 1802, Roebuck was paid off and laid up in ordinary at Woolwich Dockyard. When hostilities resumed in May 1803, she was brought back into service as a guardship at Leith, flying the flags of Vice-Admiral Richard Rodney Bligh then Rear-Admiral James Vashon under whom she later transferred to Great Yarmouth. In March 1806, she became a receiving ship, and from some point in 1810, the flagship of Lord Gardner. Roebuck was broken up at Sheerness in July 1811.

Roebuck was the prototype of the Roebuck-class ships; two-deck, fifth-rates designed to operate in the shallower waters of North America. She was designed by renowned naval architect, Sir Thomas Slade in 1769 as an improvement on his Phoenix design, and ordered by The Admiralty on 30 November. Her keel of 115 feet 9 inches , was laid down in October the following year at Chatham Dockyard.

As built, Roebuck was 140 feet 0 inches long at the gundeck, had a beam of 37 feet 9 1⁄2 inches , and a depth in the hold of 16 feet 4 inches. She measured 879 26⁄94 tons burthen.

Launched on 24 April 1774 and completed by the 4 August 1775, Roebuck cost £18,911.0.6d plus a further £1,749.5.5d for fitting.

Roebuck was built with two rows of windows in the stern, giving the illusion of an extra deck but behind was a single-level cabin. This design was eventually phased out, with most of the Roebuck-class, after HMS Dolphin, featuring a traditional frigate-style stern.

On her lower gun deck, Roebuck carried twenty 18-pounder guns. Her upper deck originally had twenty-two 9 pounders but these were later upgraded to 12 pounders. There were two 6-pounder guns on the forecastle but the quarterdeck was devoid of armament. When fully manned, Roebuck had a complement of 280. This was increased to 300 in 1783
 

JosephH

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#3
So Now I have the Admiralty drawings in solidworks and Harolds original Frames in there and all lined up. I drew several lines from the Admiralty to check that everything lines up nicely and it does (Pink Lines)

So Next tonight I will try to figure out the room and space for the standard British framing of Double frame, Single, Single, Double

once that is finished I will do some Lofting and get us some frames made. Roebuck-01.png
 
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Uwek

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#4
This Sounds like a realy interesting project.
As I remember the HMS Serapis fighting against the Bonhomme Richard was a ship of the same class, or?
Do you use also the plan of the class from the national maritime Museum Greenwich for your Research? (Edit Remark afterwards: I wrote this Question in the same Time when you send the 3rd Message.......so already answered .....thanks)
I am looking forward to See your Design and Modeling work.....Great
 
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JosephH

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#5
same class later ship though

and Harold Hahn did all the research and legwork just taking the admiralty plans and Hahns plans and redoing them to a shipoyard built type plans insetead of harolds regular single frame etc style
 

JosephH

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#6
also Uwe your name sounds familiar like on one of my R/C plane sites or some other forum same name and the avatar was a Bavarian sheild
 

JosephH

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#7
Well I tried a few different sizes now decided to try to set it up with 1 gunport and hope when I extend it comes out ok

Roebuck-02.png
 
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JosephH

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#8
Hard to tell right now with all the straight lines but I got the frames figured out after abt 6 hrs. all the frames around the gunports are the same and the ones in between adjusted the spacing's and they are within 1/2" difference between the entire line of stations. most between 2.85" spacing and 3.125" spacing at a couple wider gaps. I am pretty pleased with it.
 

Uwek

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#9
also Uwe your name sounds familiar like on one of my R/C plane sites or some other forum same name and the avatar was a Bavarian sheild
I am originally from Bavaria, But it was Not me. I built RC-Models when I was joung (already some time ago), but was never a member of such a Site. Maybe from MSW years ago, I was there an Admin in the beginning years of that Forum.
 

Uwek

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#10
Hard to tell right now with all the straight lines but I got the frames figured out ........... and they are within 1/2" difference between the entire line of stations..........I am pretty pleased with it.
Sounds realy good......congratulation for this First but very important step.
 

JosephH

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#11
im off tomorrow so after work today goingh to work on the backbone and once that is done will do some colored bars for the stations so a screenshot be easier to see them
 

JosephH

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#12
Here is a rough view of the frame layout at the dead flat area. I have an extra single in there by the center lines but going through a bunch of admiralty drawings for reference it wasnt uncommon at the dead flat to have to add or delete a frame.

Roebuck-03.png
 
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JosephH

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#14
Well tonight after work got the backbones all drawn up including the decks and the wales. I got the quarterdeck beams drawn in and tomorrow will work on the beams for the other decks and then make a framing sheet then finish the details for the keel bow and stern. then if have time will work on setting up the loft and fairing in the body so that I can create my stations. so far it is moving along nicely since last night when I started now once these drawings are all done things slow down as i cut parts and start drawing details.

Roebuck-04.png
 
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Uwek

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#15
Here is a rough view of the frame layout at the dead flat area. I have an extra single in there by the center lines but going through a bunch of admiralty drawings for reference it wasnt uncommon at the dead flat to have to add or delete a frame.
You are right, that it was often necessary to adjust the framing based on the location and arrangement of the gunports. Often they adjusted the 4.th futtocks and used curved timbers, often also by splitting a double frame at the end. Or like you mentioned added additional filling frames. Also the width of the floor timber over the different futtocks up to the top-timbers were reduced, but usually it is not shown so detailed in models. Goodwin is showing all this very good in his book „Construction and Fitting of Sailing Man of War“ with the model of the Egmont........
Very interesting to follow your log.....looking forward to see more of your work.....and many thanks
 

JosephH

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#16
thanks Uwe I am off today so will be in google hangout all day if you want to pop in I posted the link above
 

JosephH

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#17
ok so this morning I was able to get all the deck beams in place. I put all the wales on a different sket as this way I can turn lines off and on as needed while drawing things up.

Roebuck-05.png
 

JosephH

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#18
the next step is going to be doing a framing plan with the frames in place and notched out for the gunport sills etc
 

JosephH

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#19
Well before I started my frame plan I had forgot to redo the Stem, Keelson Stern posts Wing transom, deck transom, and filler transoms and front chocks.

Now that I have everything reworked and proper I can do the Frames.

Roebuck-06.png
 

JosephH

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#20
I forgot to mention early on what is going on with this set of plans. There are a few in the know but for the rest of you a short explanation my explain why i don't do this or that.

we came across these drawings in the Hahn Archives and it just hammered me this is THE ship for me.

However coming from a masters scale background in R/C Aircraft I am very much an as true to actually built as I can kinda guy.

Thus Harold was an artist and took a few liberties on his plans to create masterpieces.

Thus with me being about out of the shipyard type guy I am drawing up a set of plans as close as my limited knowledge will let me to the way the British would have built the ship at the shipyard. So there are a ton of changes I need to do so I am using the Admiralty drawings for the basis of the ship and Harold's drawings for the basic Station shapes and a few other minor things.

So that is why you might hear me say i had to go back and change something as I used Harold's basic drawings as a guide and am now adjusting them to more accurate scale fidelity.
 
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