Darron's over 90% scratch build: Sovereign Of The Seas 1:84

This Forum is all about building your ship from pure scratch, with the aid of plans, or even heavy modification or kit bashing. All can be found here.
User avatar
Darron
Seaman
Seaman
Posts: 36
Joined: Sat Jul 20, 2013 7:51 am
Location: East Rainton

Darron's over 90% scratch build: Sovereign Of The Seas 1:84

Postby Darron » Sun Jul 21, 2013 10:51 am

I intended to build the DeAGOTINI version of this ship but after finding that some of the bamboo was mouldy in October 2013, I check the hull removed more planks and found grey mould throughout the hull the only thing was to burn the ship and start over this time I've designed my own version of the ship. The first 3 pages of the diary shows the DeAGOSTINI version up to the point it was scraped from then on the build is my design of the Sovereign of the Seas, I hope you enjoy the build diary.
Image
By DeAGOSTINI
Model detail
1:84 scale (Approx. scale as real scale is historically unknown)
High-quality wooden and cast metal parts
Cannons and anchors
Cloth sails and flags
Complete rigging
Cast metal decorations
Partwork in 135 Issues (Modified)

Overall dimensions
Length: 1100mm
Height: 900mm
Beam: 400mm


Hello Shipmates! :cool:
Another Build Diary Starts HERE!

I've had stored this partwork since the August 2012 and I couldn't wait any longer to start, so in November 2012 when my Multi-Jig was free again for the next ship, I set it up the jig for the H.M.S. Sovereign of the Seas and made a start! I had to make a hutch from an old DVD storage rack I had stored in the attic to lift the Victory up above my old work area, I hope that in 2014 I can get a new shed and then switch my shipyard there.

Image
I planned to follow the magazine but at the end of January 2013 I found a big problem with the partwork (the ship advertised isn’t the same as the parts supplied by DeAGOSTINI) and I needed to make extreme modifications to the ship, as I now can’t follow the magazines measurements I have started this diary here!.
I look forward to sharing this build diary with you all and hope you will enjoy looking in on my build.

:handgestures-thumbup:
Darron
Last edited by Darron on Wed Nov 20, 2013 7:26 am, edited 1 time in total.
Image I might not be able to see what I'm doing, but I have a feeling it's RIGHT!
User avatar
Darron
Seaman
Seaman
Posts: 36
Joined: Sat Jul 20, 2013 7:51 am
Location: East Rainton

Re: Modified DeAGOSTINI:Sovereign Of The Seas 1:84 by Darron

Postby Darron » Sun Jul 21, 2013 1:01 pm

Hi Shipmates! :cool: On the 2 December 2012

Rib part 13a needed to be changed the first ones supplied were wrong and wouldn’t fit to the main part 13, so I was glad we got the replacement rib sections in issue 9. After a week of gluing ribs together, removing the excess glue before putting them between sheets of paper so they don't get stuck to the underside of the multi-jig's base, the weight of the board presses them so they set flat and remained that way until I had completed them all. At last the keel was glued together minus the extra joint support parts 10,18 & 24, it was time to get ready to put the keel into the jig.

First I laid the keel flat on the jig to get the placement of the brackets, the first end brackets were set 2mm from the centre line on the main base board, the sprit level was used to align the rest of them, then the two brackets that will cover the joint supports are loosened and the parts 10 & 24 placed between the sprit level and the brackets to set the correct spacing needed to keep the keel straight.

You will notice short lines across the ends of each slot on the keel this is to help align the ribs later when gluing them so that I know were the end of the slots are, if the rib gets stuck part of the way, then I will know straight away before the glue has a chance to dry and correct it, this is just a little safety check.

Image Image

The joint support parts 10,18 & 24 are then fitted the excess glue removed and using the ribs dry fitted next to the support to keep the blocks from moving the keel was set against the first brackets then the other side brackets are fitted tight to the keel. Clamps are used to hold the supports in place as the glue dries, after 10 minutes I checked that the ribs would be able to be removed and left the glue to set.

Lines were now put onto the ribs and the end of each slot.

Adding the glue into the slots makes pushing the rib down much harder than when it was a dry fit, this is when the reference lines come into they own. A quick look and I can see that the rib is indeed in the right place.
Image Image

A quick dry fit shows that the ribs fits all the way down the slot and is now ready to be glued into the keel’s slot, but first I quickly fitted all the ribs to checked the top of the ribs that hold the deck are correct just in case a slot was cut to long or to short, luckily the slots are all OK! and the rest of the ribs can be fitted.

Image Image

The rib support is then fitted to the multi-jig to hold the rib square while the glue dries.

The rib support glide along the channels in the base board and is locked off with the bolts the cut-out sections in the support slide over the wing nuts and the centre cut-out misses the keel so it can't get glued to the ribs by mistake. The last picture might look as if the keel has a twist but it is the camera's lens, I've checked the keel and all is square.

Image Image

When the glue on each rib has dried for 2 hours I can then glue the next rib, soon all the ribs will be fitted.

:handgestures-thumbup:

Darron
Image I might not be able to see what I'm doing, but I have a feeling it's RIGHT!
User avatar
GaryM
Senoir Chief Petty Officer
Senoir Chief Petty Officer
Posts: 1481
Joined: Mon Jan 30, 2012 8:27 pm
Location: Citrus Heights, California

Re: Modified DeAGOSTINI:Sovereign Of The Seas 1:84 by Darron

Postby GaryM » Sun Jul 21, 2013 4:26 pm

You do great work. I used to try to keep my finished work clean and free of dust. Dust destroys rigging and can cause glued parts to separate. It contains all the contaminates in the air and dirty oil products. I also had to worry about people touching things they shouldn't. Of course, there is always a chance of them getting bumped and falling over or having some type of accident. Then, I started putting them in a case after they were finished and all these problems disappeared. Your models and work deserve this treatment also.
Happy modeling,
Gary Maple

Problems are just challenges waiting for your solution.

Current build: Sergal Sovereign of the Seas
In Que: Sergal: Cutty Sark and Amerigo Vespucci; Billings Titanic
Completed: Amati: HMS Prince (old 1:78 version); Billings: Norske Love and Vasa; Mantua: La Couronne; Sergal: Mississippi Riverboat and La Soleil Royal
User avatar
Darron
Seaman
Seaman
Posts: 36
Joined: Sat Jul 20, 2013 7:51 am
Location: East Rainton

Re: Modified DeAGOSTINI:Sovereign Of The Seas 1:84 by Darron

Postby Darron » Mon Jul 22, 2013 6:42 am

:text-thankyouyellow: GaryM

I will be making a case but when the Sovereign is build, as I want both ships in the same case and until I have both ships next to each other I can't plan the case. Around 2002 I had a 30 inch PT boat smashed by a nosy plumber while getting the house modernized he leaned over some boxes to get a better look of it in its case lost his balance and pulled a book case onto it, I was just about to fit the RC units into the boat but it was just a pile of splinters. I’ve never seen a British workman move so fast, got no compensation from the landlord or the workman for the damage done, it put me off modelling for years.

Darron
Image I might not be able to see what I'm doing, but I have a feeling it's RIGHT!
User avatar
Darron
Seaman
Seaman
Posts: 36
Joined: Sat Jul 20, 2013 7:51 am
Location: East Rainton

Re: Modified DeAGOSTINI:Sovereign Of The Seas 1:84 by Darron

Postby Darron » Mon Jul 22, 2013 8:00 am

Hi Shipmates! :cool: On the 9 December 2012

My thanks go to Steve for the information he sent me about the HMS Sovereign of the SEAS Bowsprit position

I thought that the foremast was too close to the forward bulkhead from the second set of deck parts supplied in issue 14 and this might be a problem with the bowsprit and it has been confirmed thanks to Steve's plans.

First step was to remove the bow former part 8 from part 2 as I didn't want to remove all the formers on the bow, I just brushed water along the joint then use a heat gun used in paper crafts to heat the glue for 5 seconds then rewet along the joints and heated again for 5 seconds and that was all it took to soften the glue so that the part could be removed. Steam would have softened all the bow formers in that area and that was needed.

I then cleaned up the part 8 and marked it for cutting as I had a spare copy of issue 1, I've also used the two spare parts 4 marking the slot longer so that they will fit onto the bow former support fully. After the first cuts were made on the bandsaw I marked the curved sections on the formers to fit the bows shape and removing the bottom tab on both formers.

Image Image

I then cut a piece for ply from the leftover frets from the ribs to make plug to fit the central hole in part 2, the top slot for the bow former 8 was widened to fit the new bowsprit location using a 100mm dowel as a guide to get the right size and shape.

The bow former 8 and the two extra formers parts 4 that were altered were then fitted and the hole adjusted to align the dowel at a slight angle.

Image Image

This shows how the bowsprit will fit and will not interfere with the foremast at all.

Image Image

:handgestures-thumbup:

Darron
Image I might not be able to see what I'm doing, but I have a feeling it's RIGHT!
StevieF
Petty Officer Second Class
Petty Officer Second Class
Posts: 147
Joined: Thu Oct 11, 2012 9:05 am
Location: Enland, West Country

Re: Modified DeAGOSTINI:Sovereign Of The Seas 1:84 by Darron

Postby StevieF » Mon Jul 22, 2013 6:13 pm

Good morning to you Darron.
So glad to see your build back on the net again!
You will like it here, a nice quiet set of modellers without the cliques of other forums. I will have to make sure I keep up with your build diary, I wouldn't want to miss anything.
Take care, Steve..
User avatar
Darron
Seaman
Seaman
Posts: 36
Joined: Sat Jul 20, 2013 7:51 am
Location: East Rainton

Re: Modified DeAGOSTINI:Sovereign Of The Seas 1:84 by Darron

Postby Darron » Tue Jul 23, 2013 10:31 am

:text-thankyouyellow: Steve

It's nice to get my information on the net again so other's can enjoy my work!

Hi Shipmates! :cool: On the 5 January 2013

I cut the small triangle out of the false keel from the forward bulkhead to the deck, this was meant to support the bowsprit, well it was before the bowsprit was offset to its new position. The first deck was fitted as per the magazine with no problems, all the deck parts fitted perfectly.

I had to do a little working-out of the scale of the ship in the poster supplied with issue 1 to get the length of the bowsprit at the ship's scale of 1:84, using the rescale measurements Excel file I wrote (the picture shows the file used twice to show all the data) I first measured the length of the hull in the picture this was around 65 cm and the bowsprit was around 16.5 cm from the front of the forward bulkhead. I entered these into the rescale measurements file '84' into the Start Scale, '110' into the long white box under the Start Scale, then set the pull-down menu to read 'cm' in the light blue box for the length, I also set the pull-down menu in the dark blue box to 'cm' and then adjusted the convert to scale until I got the converted measurement in the dark blue box to read about 65cm. This gave me a scale of 1/142 for the ship in the poster. Using this scale I reversed the Start Scale and Convert to Scale values, entered 16.5 into the long white box to get the bowsprit measurement that would need to be about 28 cm from the front of the forward bulkhead.

Image Image

I added two small temporary blocks of wood to hold the bowsprit to the correct angle of around about 4 degrees. These can be removed when the small deck at the bow is added.

Image Image

I've checked the alignment of the tip of the bowsprit with the main and mizzen mast locations, all are now in alignment

Image

That's all for now, I'm glad to be back to work on the ship, but I need the gunport locations before I can go on much further as I need to frame the gunport before I start to plank the sides (due to sight problems). Still there are some jobs that I can do while I wait for the information to appear in the magazines, gallery framing and dummy cannon supports these are going to be done differently to the magazine.

:handgestures-thumbup:

Darron
Image I might not be able to see what I'm doing, but I have a feeling it's RIGHT!
User avatar
Darron
Seaman
Seaman
Posts: 36
Joined: Sat Jul 20, 2013 7:51 am
Location: East Rainton

Re: Modified DeAGOSTINI:Sovereign Of The Seas 1:84 by Darron

Postby Darron » Wed Jul 24, 2013 3:08 pm

Hi Shipmates! :cool: On the 27 January 2013

I made a start on the gallery support frame for the stern following the magazine using elastic band to hold the parts together while the glue dries.

Image Image

Image Image

I dry fitted the next deck to keep the ribs spaced correctly as I cut the frames for the gun ports and then started to frame the lower gun deck ports, I do this to get around a problem I have with my sight, I have problems getting the ports right following the method in the instructions. Also I can get the ports set to the correct height relative to each deck be choosing the right size wood for the lower section of the frame in this case 5mm x 5mm. this way I don't end up with my upper gun ports too close to the deck, with the gun barrel touching the top of the port. I then use a block the size of the gun port opening (12mm x 13mm) to set the top section of the frame, STOP!!!! :angry-banghead:

Image Image

ISSUE 14 The Last Lower Gun Port!

I’ve noticed that in the Sovereign of the Seas issue 14 step 1 cuts away the dummy gun support beams or stringers that protrudes for rib frame 26. If you want to add a dummy gun here then it shouldn’t be cut, wait until you fit parts 49 before adding the last part of the gun support so you can fit the last dummy cannon on the lower gun deck. In issue 35 the gun ports are marked and cut-out there is an open gun port between frame 26 & 49 on that deck, without the beam to fit the dummy cannon in place and no way to fit one, once the lower hull is complete, the result will be that the gun port lib will have to be left closed. The Italians are a lot further on with the build than the UK is.

NOW FOR THE BAD NEWS! :angry-cussingblack:

The build was put on hold due to problems with the height of the decks. Ever wondered about that gap between the lower deck and the false keel, I think it shouldn't be there if you want the ship to look like the one advertised and the decks are too close to each other. This came clear as I started to fit the frames for the gun ports on the lower deck and found that the gap between the top of the lower gun ports and the bottom of the mid deck gun ports are too close for the chainwales to fit correctly, the lower gun ports are way too high, they don't match the ship advertised at all.

I was in two minds about steaming apart the work I’ve done! cutting each ribs centre down to match the false keel, removing some of the deck support brackets so I can drop the decks and correcting all the mistakes or to cancel my subscription at the newsagents to this build, I just got most of the parts I needed to light the inside of the ship and some of the extra wood and beech dowels I wanted for this ship Total cost just over £70.00, I would have liked to build the ship that has been advertised.


THE DECISION!

Well my decision was to continue the build, or should I say rebuild! I'm going to get the parts and use the magazine as a guide only, changing things as I see fit. TOTALLY UNOFFICIAL!. It's my build and it won't be like the rest, a one-off version of this partwork. I sent a message at the end of Januay 2013 that has been passed to DeAGOSTINI who will take up my points up with Artesania, only time will tell what their say. I'm going ahead with my changes anyway even if their say there isn't any problems with the partwork or the parts supplied by DeAGOSTINI.

After many hours of looking at the pictures I got off the YouTube footage of the prototype I found that the lower deck is indeed too high, if it is lowered to the false keel it is about right. There is 5 planks between the top of the lower gun port and the bottom of the mid decks gun ports, there is 3 planks between the top of the mid gun ports and the bottom of the upper gun port. Both deck get wider apart as you get closer to the stern of the ship.

If you have a copy of the poster from issue 1 SOTS just look at the gap between the top of the lower gun port and the bottom of the door, it's unbelievable! The more I check this build the more changes I find! Not only has the transom been changed but the gallery support is now curved the prototype is flat with the outer sides curved from the hull to the underside of the gallery.

There are now curved bulkheads on the upper deck between the other deck levels the prototype these are straight. These do match picture and other kits of this ship so these changes are OK!

This build has become a real nightmare, but I think I can fix most of the problems I’ve found! This means a total rebuild of the ship and correcting the position of parts as I find them, no-doubt I will have to face up to many more problems later in the build some of my own making. By changing the location of the decks I hope to create more space so I can fit the details and chainwales in the correct positions, this means I won’t be able to rely on the magazines measurements at all, some of the metal details may need to be made larger, I’ll use green stuff for that.

I can’t hold DeAGOSTINI responsible for any changes I make.

:handgestures-thumbup:

Darron
Last edited by Darron on Fri Jul 26, 2013 10:18 am, edited 2 times in total.
Image I might not be able to see what I'm doing, but I have a feeling it's RIGHT!
User avatar
Darron
Seaman
Seaman
Posts: 36
Joined: Sat Jul 20, 2013 7:51 am
Location: East Rainton

Re: Modified DeAGOSTINI:Sovereign Of The Seas 1:84 by Darron

Postby Darron » Wed Jul 24, 2013 3:31 pm

Hi Shipmates! :cool: On the 3 February 2013

OPPERATION CRAZY REFIT!

DISASSEMBLING THE SHIP

As you can see there is quite a big gap between the deck and the false keel!

I decided to get a small steam clearer to work on the ship it's quicker to heat up and isn't as difficult to use as the larger steam clearer. Removing the deck pieces takes time to carefully lift the deck after steaming along the join to ease the pins up without breaking the deck.

Image Image

Once all the deck parts have been removed I had to remove the ribs and the gallery frame from the false keel, but first I marked the place the keel crosses the rib so I know how much needs to be removed from each rib, I also wrote the measurement on the rib just in case the line was removed. Most of the ribs came away without much trouble but the ones next to the keel bracing pieces were a real pain, taking anything up to 30 minutes to safely remove them. I left the bow frame 2 and the bow former in place as I didn't need to change them. With all the ribs removed I marked each to show how much was to cut-out to lower the deck to the false keel.

Image Image

I used my bandsaw to remove the excess wood from each rib, it was the best tool for the job and I had all the ribs cut in minutes, the first thing to go well today!. As you can see the cut has removed part of the dovetail joints on the ribs weakening the joint but I will soon be strengthening the joints with small blocks of ply glued and pinned. I will use the offcuts from the centre of each rib and some pieces cut from the frets leftover from the ribs as there are some areas large enough to do the job.

Image Image

A quick dry fit to check the parts are OK! then it's back to the pictures to work out the position of the mid deck it looks like I will need to drop that deck by about 2mm.

Image Image

That's all for now!

:handgestures-thumbup:

Darron
Image I might not be able to see what I'm doing, but I have a feeling it's RIGHT!
NMBROOK
Petty Officer Second Class
Petty Officer Second Class
Posts: 143
Joined: Mon Jul 15, 2013 6:03 pm
Location: Yorkshire England

Re: Modified DeAGOSTINI:Sovereign Of The Seas 1:84 by Darron

Postby NMBROOK » Thu Jul 25, 2013 4:44 pm

Nice work Darron,this is what the ship needed,unfortunately I was even further ahead when I realised the model wasn't as advertised.I had a fully planked hull as I was using my own planking.
Kind Regards Nigel

Return to “SOS Build Logs Scratch or from Plans”

Who is online

Users browsing this forum: No registered users and 1 guest