Independence rigging problems

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steveslight
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Re: Independence rigging problems

Postby steveslight » Sun Apr 27, 2014 4:29 am

Hi Clare,
thanks for the response.
I was going to contact you as I saw you were building the same model, (comparing notes on construction).

All your comments make sense and I will follow your suggestions and observations. Some pathways of lines I have used common sense to match blocks together (at the ends of booms, for instance).

I have sent Donnie some photos of where I'm at, hoping he can interpret the deck blocks' use from their positions.

Thank you for your time and help.

Regards,
Steve
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Donnie
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Re: Independence rigging problems

Postby Donnie » Wed Apr 30, 2014 6:24 pm

How's your rigging going? Were you able to get that link that I made for you?

Donnie
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catopower
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Re: Independence rigging problems

Postby catopower » Wed Apr 30, 2014 7:39 pm

Hi Steve,

Hope Donnie link helped. His post reminded me to post my info as well.

So, I was looking at the rigging plan and, sure enough, there is no indication as to what lines go through those blocks on the deck! All the belaying points are pretty clearly marked, but they just ignored those blocks. Since I'm going to have to go through the same thing, I'm going to work this out too.

To sort things out, here's proper terminology for the items I'll mention on the vessel, which is a Foretopsail Schooner or simply a Topsail Schooner. You may already know all this, but I just want to make sure everyone is on the same page. The fore-and-aft sails are the Foresail on the forward or Fore Mast and the Mainsail on the aft or Main Mast. There is no mizzen or spanker. The gaffs are the spars at the heads of the sails, and the booms are the spars at the base. Finally, on the foremast are a lower yard and a topsail yard.

The halliards that are used to haul up the gaffs are the throat halliards, which are close to the mast and the peak halliards, which are furthest from the mast. The lines used to turn the yards from side to side and are braces and they are attached at the ends of the yards.


Looks like there are a total of 9 blocks on the deck. One is easy to define, the other 8 are not so clear. This is only how I would rig the model, not necessarily the only way to do it...

In general, I would pass the peak halliards through the port side blocks and the throat halliards through the starboard side blocks. That takes care of the two blocks at the foremast and two of the blocks at the mainmast. The other two at the mainmast and the two just forward of the quarter deck are the least clear to me.

Personally, I think I would run the lower yard braces through the other pair of blocks at the mainmast and belay them as indicated on the plans. Then, run the topsail yard braces through the blocks near the quarter deck, but belay them to the bitts up on the quarter deck instead of the main bitts where the plans indicate. Otherwise, I think you're going to end up with lines tangling underfoot.

So:

1 - The block just forward of the mainmast is for the fore sheet tackle. I think that one is easy enough to follow.

2, 3 - The blocks at the foremast I would use for the fore gaff halliards. Peak halliard (#236) to port and throat halliard (#235) to starboard. Belay them to the nearby cleats.

4,5 - Two of the blocks at the mainmast (choose the ones which allow all the lines to best run free and clear of other lines) I would use for the main gaff halliards. Peak halliard (#243) to port and throat halliard (#242) to starboard. Lines are belayed on the main cross bits just forward of the mainmast.

6,7 - The other two blocks at the mainmast, I would use for the lower yard braces (#283). Run the lines down through the blocks and belay on the main cross bits.

8,9 - The two blocks near the quarter deck and the deck pumps, I would use for the topsail yard braces (#284). I think blocks for these are least necessary, but I can't see anything else that you would need to pass through blocks on the deck. In any case, pass the lines through these blocks and belay up on the quarterdeck cross bitts.

One more thing, the rigging diagrams appear to show blocks tied directly to the mainmast as in figures 3 and 6. It's a ridiculous configuration as it would prevent you from raising or lowering the mainsail. I recommend possibly tying single blocks instead to the main shrouds, or up at the main trestletrees. I'd personally put single blocks on either side of the forward end of the main trestletrees for the

So, there it is for what it's worth. Even if you don't use this information, it's helped me figure out how I'm going to rig my model. But, I hope it's useful to you.

Clare
steveslight
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Re: Independence rigging problems

Postby steveslight » Thu May 01, 2014 1:15 am

Hi Donnie,

I'm still doing the obvious ones following their instructions. On the basis that the ones that are left over, the not so obvious ones, might fall into place. The diagrams you sent have helped a great deal and I will follow your suggestions when I get to that stage. At the moment I'm doing the ratlines and shrouds, which is a slow and painstaking task, as you know.
Did you mean the link with the diagrams you labeled for me? If so then yes and will follow the suggestion when I get to that bit.
Thanks again for all your time and trouble helping.

Steve
Last edited by steveslight on Thu May 01, 2014 1:42 am, edited 1 time in total.
steveslight
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Re: Independence rigging problems

Postby steveslight » Thu May 01, 2014 1:36 am

Hi Clare,

Thank you so much for going through the plans. I'm pleased that you have found them badly lacking in instructions as I have.
I too thought it ridiculous to have a block tied to a mast preventing the sail being raised or lowered. Just one example of bad instructions.
I will go along with all of your suggestions and comments. Not knowing too much about ship's rigging, having someone like yourself to confer with is great.
I don't know how anyone with no experience would complete this model without help. I did try e-mailing the company, but of course there was no response. No after sales service there then!

Thanks again and good luck with your build.
Steve
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catopower
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Re: Independence rigging problems

Postby catopower » Thu May 01, 2014 10:04 pm

Hi Steve,

No problem. It was helpful for me too.

Nearly all kits fall short on instructions. I think it's something that takes a lot of diagrams and text to explain how to do it properly, and most companies just can't afford the hours it takes given their limited market and all. The same applies for support. In fact, I think many companies are trying to save on costs by outsourcing most of their designs and don't have anyone to answer questions. Some outsource manufacture too and can't supply replacement parts either.

Most people, who aren't on forums, probably just guess and you can tell the less experienced builders by the way they interpreted the plans. Most people would never notice any small rigging errors, so it probably doesn't matter to much.

The rest of us make the best of it, and help each other out on Ships of Scale :D

Clare
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Donnie
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Re: Independence rigging problems

Postby Donnie » Sat May 03, 2014 12:22 pm

Its sad that I have to admit that I still lack in the area of technical knowledge of all the terms such as Clare brought out. I offered the best I could with what little that I had (knowledge wise). Probably the reason I don't offer too much advise on a lot of post. Then again, between my real job, and lifes responsibilities, and then spent a lot of time studying terms, I probably would not have a ship even come close to being finished.

I am very glad that Clare stepped in and took over.

But I do know where to come when I need help myself. :D My Trinidad rigging plates are full of the most gosh awful belaying pin assignments. It has been rough trying to get this thing done.
Current Build Prep: Panart San Felipe 1:75
Completed Build: Santisima Trinidad

Main SOS Site: Ships of Scale Website

No Guts, No Glory !

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